[Homeroast] Homeroast Digest, Vol 97, Issue 7

John M. Howison johnmhowison at gmail.com
Wed Feb 24 14:06:02 CST 2016


Haven't been in Naples in a long time, but I think this guy is pieno di
pruni.  In my day, the best  in Italy was great, the second best not.  I
can buy a lousy expresso in my neighborhood, but in my opinion, a middfle
class American can (but doesn't always) drink better wine than he can
afford to do in France, readily find beer as good as Belgian, and drink
coffee as good as anyone -- haven't been in Vienna lately.  Times change,
and often the good stuff goes (even from Naples) where the money goes  The
best coffee I've had lately came from a farm in Guatemala via Sweet Maria's
and was made by a half-asleep old codger in my kitchen.

On Wed, Feb 24, 2016 at 12:00 PM, <
homeroast-request at lists.sweetmariascoffee.com> wrote:

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> Sweet Maria's Home Coffee Roasting "HomeRoast List" Digest
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. Why is espresso in America so bad? Italian perspective
>       (Michael Rasmussen)
>    2. Re: Why is espresso in America so bad? Italian    perspective
>       (Steve Hamm)
>    3. Re: Why is espresso in America so bad? Italian    perspective
>       (Greg Hollrigel)
>    4. Re: Why is espresso in America so bad? Italian perspective
>       (John Nanci)
>    5. Re: Why is espresso in America so bad? Italian    perspective
>       (Michael Koenig)
>    6. Re: Why is espresso in America so bad? Italian    perspective
>       (Brian Kamnetz)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Tue, 23 Feb 2016 18:40:58 -0800
> From: Michael Rasmussen <michael at michaelsnet.us>
> To: "A list to discuss home coffee roasting. There are rules for this
>         list,   available at http://www.sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html"
>         <homeroast at lists.sweetmariascoffee.com>
> Subject: [Homeroast] Why is espresso in America so bad? Italian
>         perspective
> Message-ID: <20160224024058.GA12529 at jamhome.us>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> This Rome native transplanted to San Francisco critiques and analyzes US
> coffee.
>
> https://medium.com/@sinzone/why-is-espresso-in-america-so-bad-b0606d8ddeb5#.ubzk6ojd0
>
> --
>       Michael Rasmussen, Portland Oregon
>     Be Appropriate && Follow Your Curiosity
> The universe is a program. You're just a subroutine.
>     ~ Zach Weiner
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2016 07:53:48 -0600
> From: Steve Hamm <steve.hamm at gmail.com>
> To: "A list to discuss home coffee roasting. There are rules for this
>         list,   available at http://www.sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html"
>         <homeroast at lists.sweetmariascoffee.com>
> Subject: Re: [Homeroast] Why is espresso in America so bad? Italian
>         perspective
> Message-ID:
>         <
> CAKjUjCimxG3MEnT6-qHWVQDzo+1WWLd3u6MwtvEcPkcc-NRnJA at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
> Interesting. Last time I was in Italy, I remember the espresso as being OK
> but nowhere great, the analogue of Folgers made on a Bunn drip machine.
>
> I'd expect that the author probably wouldn't like most single-origin shots.
> It wouldn't have that commercially homogenized flavor it seems he expects.
>
> I had been thinking about this sort of thing, taste preferences in
> coffee/espresso, and robusta vs arabica in very dark roasts (as I've heard
> that Italian espresso blends use robusta). This thinking was prompted by a
> sample of Death Wish Coffee I got from a colleague. Death Wish is IMHO
> coffee fraud -- dark roast robusta with the flavor of burnt tires, but good
> marketing.
>
> So, putting it mildly: taste varies.
>
> On Tue, Feb 23, 2016 at 8:40 PM, Michael Rasmussen <michael at michaelsnet.us
> >
> wrote:
>
> > This Rome native transplanted to San Francisco critiques and analyzes US
> > coffee.
> >
> >
> https://medium.com/@sinzone/why-is-espresso-in-america-so-bad-b0606d8ddeb5#.ubzk6ojd0
> >
> > --
> >       Michael Rasmussen, Portland Oregon
> >     Be Appropriate && Follow Your Curiosity
> > The universe is a program. You're just a subroutine.
> >     ~ Zach Weiner
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Homeroast mailing list
> > Homeroast at lists.sweetmariascoffee.com
> >
> >
> http://lists.sweetmariascoffee.com/mailman/listinfo/homeroast_lists.sweetmariascoffee.com
> > <a href="http://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/forum/">Sweet Maria's
> Forum</a>
> > <a href="http://www.sweetmarias.com/library">Our new Coffee Library</a>
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2016 06:24:25 -0800
> From: Greg Hollrigel <ghollrigel at gmail.com>
> To: "A list to discuss home coffee roasting. There are rules for this
>         list,   available at http://www.sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html"
>         <homeroast at lists.sweetmariascoffee.com>
> Subject: Re: [Homeroast] Why is espresso in America so bad? Italian
>         perspective
> Message-ID:
>         <CAMKoSor8hgSO0h1Ly-Nb+MfbSQYUmawQ2FC=bBe1OBr=
> u0Vkgg at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
> I enjoyed reading the article.  Thanks Mike.
>
> I also found it interesting, and recently I've been thinking about the
> different styles of espresso at shops here in Southern California and up in
> the SF Bay Area.  My favorite coffee shop in the Bay Area (in Oakland)
> always has pulled syrupy delicious shots that are consistently good, and I
> think they are lower volume than what I typically get down south.  I
> definitely prefer the smaller volume shots of the Oakland shop.
>
> My only experience of "Italian" espresso was from an older Italian guy in
> Seattle who runs a very small shop.  He was a great guy and put a smile on
> my face.  But, he added white sugar in the dry coffee in the portafilter.
> I was shocked by that, but I guessed it was the way it was done in Italy.
> I don't know if that's right.  I didn't care for that kind of espresso.
> Much preferred the espressos I had at other 3rd wave shots.
>
> I'm lucky enough to be taking my first trip to France & Italy this summer,
> and I'm looking forward to trying their coffees more and see if it's as
> good as people claim.  I am hoping the coffee in each place is as good as
> what I get in London.  :-)
>
> Greg
>
>
> On Wed, Feb 24, 2016 at 5:53 AM, Steve Hamm <steve.hamm at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Interesting. Last time I was in Italy, I remember the espresso as being
> OK
> > but nowhere great, the analogue of Folgers made on a Bunn drip machine.
> >
> > I'd expect that the author probably wouldn't like most single-origin
> shots.
> > It wouldn't have that commercially homogenized flavor it seems he
> expects.
> >
> > I had been thinking about this sort of thing, taste preferences in
> > coffee/espresso, and robusta vs arabica in very dark roasts (as I've
> heard
> > that Italian espresso blends use robusta). This thinking was prompted by
> a
> > sample of Death Wish Coffee I got from a colleague. Death Wish is IMHO
> > coffee fraud -- dark roast robusta with the flavor of burnt tires, but
> good
> > marketing.
> >
> > So, putting it mildly: taste varies.
> >
> > On Tue, Feb 23, 2016 at 8:40 PM, Michael Rasmussen <
> michael at michaelsnet.us
> > >
> > wrote:
> >
> > > This Rome native transplanted to San Francisco critiques and analyzes
> US
> > > coffee.
> > >
> > >
> >
> https://medium.com/@sinzone/why-is-espresso-in-america-so-bad-b0606d8ddeb5#.ubzk6ojd0
> > >
> > > --
> > >       Michael Rasmussen, Portland Oregon
> > >     Be Appropriate && Follow Your Curiosity
> > > The universe is a program. You're just a subroutine.
> > >     ~ Zach Weiner
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Homeroast mailing list
> > > Homeroast at lists.sweetmariascoffee.com
> > >
> > >
> >
> http://lists.sweetmariascoffee.com/mailman/listinfo/homeroast_lists.sweetmariascoffee.com
> > > <a href="http://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/forum/">Sweet Maria's
> > Forum</a>
> > > <a href="http://www.sweetmarias.com/library">Our new Coffee
> Library</a>
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Homeroast mailing list
> > Homeroast at lists.sweetmariascoffee.com
> >
> >
> http://lists.sweetmariascoffee.com/mailman/listinfo/homeroast_lists.sweetmariascoffee.com
> > <a href="http://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/forum/">Sweet Maria's
> Forum</a>
> > <a href="http://www.sweetmarias.com/library">Our new Coffee Library</a>
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2016 06:40:18 -0800
> From: John Nanci <john at chocolatealchemy.com>
> To: A list to discuss home coffee "roasting." There are rules for this
>         "list, "        available at "
> http://www.sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html"
>         <homeroast at lists.sweetmariascoffee.com>
> Subject: Re: [Homeroast] Why is espresso in America so bad? Italian
>         perspective
> Message-ID: <56CDC0D2.6050405 at chocolatealchemy.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
>
> I really tried to keep an open mind but he lost basically all cred with
> me when he said new machines should not be used because old machines
> taste like coffee.  Sorry, no.  That's nasty.
>
> Frankly he sounds like someone that's never pulled espresso.
>
> The espresso I had in Italy was ok.  Generally speaking better on
> average that what I can find in the states but  it didn't blow me away.
>
> John
>
> On 2/24/2016 6:24 AM, Greg Hollrigel wrote:
> > I enjoyed reading the article.  Thanks Mike.
> >
> > I also found it interesting, and recently I've been thinking about the
> > different styles of espresso at shops here in Southern California and up
> in
> > the SF Bay Area.  My favorite coffee shop in the Bay Area (in Oakland)
> > always has pulled syrupy delicious shots that are consistently good, and
> I
> > think they are lower volume than what I typically get down south.  I
> > definitely prefer the smaller volume shots of the Oakland shop.
> >
> > My only experience of "Italian" espresso was from an older Italian guy in
> > Seattle who runs a very small shop.  He was a great guy and put a smile
> on
> > my face.  But, he added white sugar in the dry coffee in the portafilter.
> > I was shocked by that, but I guessed it was the way it was done in Italy.
> > I don't know if that's right.  I didn't care for that kind of espresso.
> > Much preferred the espressos I had at other 3rd wave shots.
> >
> > I'm lucky enough to be taking my first trip to France & Italy this
> summer,
> > and I'm looking forward to trying their coffees more and see if it's as
> > good as people claim.  I am hoping the coffee in each place is as good as
> > what I get in London.  :-)
> >
> > Greg
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Feb 24, 2016 at 5:53 AM, Steve Hamm <steve.hamm at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> >> Interesting. Last time I was in Italy, I remember the espresso as being
> OK
> >> but nowhere great, the analogue of Folgers made on a Bunn drip machine.
> >>
> >> I'd expect that the author probably wouldn't like most single-origin
> shots.
> >> It wouldn't have that commercially homogenized flavor it seems he
> expects.
> >>
> >> I had been thinking about this sort of thing, taste preferences in
> >> coffee/espresso, and robusta vs arabica in very dark roasts (as I've
> heard
> >> that Italian espresso blends use robusta). This thinking was prompted
> by a
> >> sample of Death Wish Coffee I got from a colleague. Death Wish is IMHO
> >> coffee fraud -- dark roast robusta with the flavor of burnt tires, but
> good
> >> marketing.
> >>
> >> So, putting it mildly: taste varies.
> >>
> >> On Tue, Feb 23, 2016 at 8:40 PM, Michael Rasmussen <
> michael at michaelsnet.us
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>> This Rome native transplanted to San Francisco critiques and analyzes
> US
> >>> coffee.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> https://medium.com/@sinzone/why-is-espresso-in-america-so-bad-b0606d8ddeb5#.ubzk6ojd0
> >>> --
> >>>        Michael Rasmussen, Portland Oregon
> >>>      Be Appropriate && Follow Your Curiosity
> >>> The universe is a program. You're just a subroutine.
> >>>      ~ Zach Weiner
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Homeroast mailing list
> >>> Homeroast at lists.sweetmariascoffee.com
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> http://lists.sweetmariascoffee.com/mailman/listinfo/homeroast_lists.sweetmariascoffee.com
> >>> <a href="http://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/forum/">Sweet Maria's
> >> Forum</a>
> >>> <a href="http://www.sweetmarias.com/library">Our new Coffee
> Library</a>
> >>>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Homeroast mailing list
> >> Homeroast at lists.sweetmariascoffee.com
> >>
> >>
> http://lists.sweetmariascoffee.com/mailman/listinfo/homeroast_lists.sweetmariascoffee.com
> >> <a href="http://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/forum/">Sweet Maria's
> Forum</a>
> >> <a href="http://www.sweetmarias.com/library">Our new Coffee Library</a>
> >>
> > _______________________________________________
> > Homeroast mailing list
> > Homeroast at lists.sweetmariascoffee.com
> >
> http://lists.sweetmariascoffee.com/mailman/listinfo/homeroast_lists.sweetmariascoffee.com
> > <a href="http://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/forum/">Sweet Maria's
> Forum</a>
> > <a href="http://www.sweetmarias.com/library">Our new Coffee Library</a>
> >
>
>
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2016 10:11:38 -0500
> From: Michael Koenig <koenig.mike at gmail.com>
> To: "A list to discuss home coffee roasting. There are rules for this
>         list,   available at http://www.sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html"
>         <homeroast at lists.sweetmariascoffee.com>
> Subject: Re: [Homeroast] Why is espresso in America so bad? Italian
>         perspective
> Message-ID: <F0543E3E-6351-4987-BFAD-495A3B5B72C7 at icloud.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain;       charset=us-ascii
>
> Wow,  this article reminds me of the American I ran into in Italy saying
> that the pizza at home in the US was better than in Naples.
>
> --mike
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On Feb 23, 2016, at 9:40 PM, Michael Rasmussen <michael at michaelsnet.us>
> wrote:
> >
> > This Rome native transplanted to San Francisco critiques and analyzes US
> coffee.
> >
> https://medium.com/@sinzone/why-is-espresso-in-america-so-bad-b0606d8ddeb5#.ubzk6ojd0
> >
> > --
> >      Michael Rasmussen, Portland Oregon
> >    Be Appropriate && Follow Your Curiosity
> > The universe is a program. You're just a subroutine.
> >    ~ Zach Weiner
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Homeroast mailing list
> > Homeroast at lists.sweetmariascoffee.com
> >
> http://lists.sweetmariascoffee.com/mailman/listinfo/homeroast_lists.sweetmariascoffee.com
> > <a href="http://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/forum/">Sweet Maria's
> Forum</a>
> > <a href="http://www.sweetmarias.com/library">Our new Coffee Library</a>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2016 11:11:53 -0600
> From: Brian Kamnetz <bkamnetz at gmail.com>
> To: "A list to discuss home coffee roasting. There are rules for this
>         list,   available at http://www.sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html"
>         <homeroast at lists.sweetmariascoffee.com>
> Subject: Re: [Homeroast] Why is espresso in America so bad? Italian
>         perspective
> Message-ID:
>         <CAFH=DT1=
> RBNPCNhy_Bqyk_RjOOtu6oVijNt9Z-K9kp3vqgExEQ at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
> Interesting article. Thanks for posting the link.
>
> Brian
>
> On Tue, Feb 23, 2016 at 8:40 PM, Michael Rasmussen <michael at michaelsnet.us
> >
> wrote:
>
> > This Rome native transplanted to San Francisco critiques and analyzes US
> > coffee.
> >
> >
> https://medium.com/@sinzone/why-is-espresso-in-america-so-bad-b0606d8ddeb5#.ubzk6ojd0
> >
> > --
> >       Michael Rasmussen, Portland Oregon
> >     Be Appropriate && Follow Your Curiosity
> > The universe is a program. You're just a subroutine.
> >     ~ Zach Weiner
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Homeroast mailing list
> > Homeroast at lists.sweetmariascoffee.com
> >
> >
> http://lists.sweetmariascoffee.com/mailman/listinfo/homeroast_lists.sweetmariascoffee.com
> > <a href="http://www.sweetmariascoffee.com/forum/">Sweet Maria's
> Forum</a>
> > <a href="http://www.sweetmarias.com/library">Our new Coffee Library</a>
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Subject: Digest Footer
>
> _______________________________________________
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>
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> End of Homeroast Digest, Vol 97, Issue 7
> ****************************************
>



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Contra muros, mater rubicolla


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