[Homeroast] Greens Storage Long Term RE: Homeroast Digest, Vol 81, Issue 27

Peter Louton peter at midwestbicycleworks.com
Thu Nov 6 06:56:28 CST 2014

Thanks for that Mike.  It was very interesting. I guess the real test would be stored for years compared current crop and also say Charbucks or Peets or such. Would the stored coffee still be better?   Hmmm...


Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 6, 2014, at 1:22 AM, miKe mcKoffee <mckona at comcast.net> wrote:
> Everyone's palettes are different yet amongst those with proven discerning
> palettes no way would greens be worth much after five years stored room
> temperature. Quite some time ago I did a 4 crop cycle storage test of Costa
> Rica La Minita. Greens from 2001, '02 & '03 vacuum sealed and stored at room
> temperature from the time I received them from SM until I received 2004
> crop. I then profile roasted them all identically and cupped them. I alone
> did not cup them but sent them to a couple others including Tom. There's a
> commonly held basic rule of 15's in coffee and this test bore out the first
> rule. To be at it's best coffee greens should be roasted within 15 months of
> harvest, roasted coffee should be brewed within 15 days of roasting, coffee
> should be brewed within 15 minutes after it's ground. Here is his cut &
> paste post of his results from July 21, 2004.
> Begin cut & paste:
> Okay - not sure how we are doing this Mike but I am done (need to start
> packing for Chicago now!) . I whipped up a web page with comments. Should I
> wait to upload it ? Well ... hmm, actually I can't really wait to do it.
> Okay - I will put the link at the bottom of this email and DONT visit it if
> the results need to be coordinated with the other scores before releasing
> the findings.
> Comments: I was impressed with the roasting Mike - excellent! 
> Overall, the coffees did not taste as old as they should have. 
> Disappointment: '04, while easy for me to pick out, did not distinguish
> itself like I feel it should have.
> The URL describes all my impressions and shows the scores:
> http://www.sweetmarias.com/CostaRicaLaMinitaCupping.html
> Sidebar: My thoughts during this cupping are about my CRLM dilemma- As you
> know, I have an odd relationship with CRLM - a clean coffee that might be
> too clean - the longer I go along in the coffee trade, the mess I drink it
> because it's just not that exciting. I had downgraded '04 based on
> recuppings a little while back. But I sort of doubt myself on this too. A
> lot of people want an extremely clean and mild coffee, and this is it. When
> a coffee costs more, it's always a struggle to explain that doesn't mean it
> has 2x or 3x or Jamaica 4x the cup quality. There is not one thing called
> cup quality - what I rate is the cup quality for that type of coffee, be it
> husky, rustic and natural, or sweet & clean, or bright and citric etc etc.
> So with La Minita the score reflects how it rates for sweet and clean cups. 
> And in a way the descriptors talk more about how it is a truly model farm,
> and everything about the way they do things is how coffee should be treated.
> But, but, but ... I don't get excited about this cup, and I can't get that
> out of my head. I promised myself that I would always be true to my senses
> on a coffee - evrything is cupped blind, ignore labels and ask yourself what
> is "great coffee"? I wonder about this and, while JBM has improved
> dramatically in the last 2 years, I have the same dilemma there... oh well,
> typical T.O. 
> angst. If I don't have enough worries I always make up a few...
> Tom
> End cut & paste
> I and others have also proven you can cheat the rule of 15's which applies
> to normal ambient storage conditions. Many years ago Michael Sivetz
> scientifically proved hermetically sealing and deep freezing roasted coffee
> at -40f 100% halted aging. I've tested over a year vacuum sealing (which
> satisfies hermetically sealed requirement) and freezing ~0f home freezer
> roasted coffee remains very nearly the same as freshly roasted, one "proof
> of the pudding" pulling 90% crema shots over a year later. Crema doesn't
> exist with stale coffee! I've also vacuum sealed and frozen select very
> expensive greens a number of years and then roasted with extremely good
> results, no hints of bagginess or loss of acidity which is always the first
> to go.
> YMMV. Believe what you will, old coffee unless stored under strict specific
> conditions will taste like old coffee.
> Slave to the Bean miKe mcKoffee
> www.CompassCoffeeRoasting.com
> URL to Rosto mods, FrankenFormer, some recipes etc:
> http://www.mckoffee.com/
> Ultimately the quest for Koffee Nirvana is a solitary path. To know I must
> first not know. And in knowing know I know not. Each Personal enlightenment
> found exploring the many divergent foot steps of Those who have gone before.
> Sweet Maria's List - Searchable Archives http://themeyers.org/HomeRoast/
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Homeroast [mailto:homeroast-bounces at lists.sweetmariascoffee.com] On
> Behalf Of Starfinder Stanley
> Sent: Saturday, November 01, 2014 10:48 AM
> To: A list to discuss home coffee roasting. There are rules for this
> list,available at http://www.sweetmarias.com/maillistinfo.html
> Subject: Re: [Homeroast] Homeroast Digest, Vol 81, Issue 27
> I find that quality beans sealed in 5 gallon buckets and stored in a cool
> place keep surprisingly well.  I found a bucket I'd misplaced after a move
> from more than five years ago; the beans were a little drier, a bit
> yellower, and roasted faster, but the flavor is still great ---who knows,
> maybe I just got lucky, but I tend to buy certain hard-to-find beans in full
> bags when there's a good year and stockpile it, with good results. 
> Sent from my iPad
>> On Nov 1, 2014, at 9:21 AM, Howard B <howardbandy at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi Hank --
>> Having an adequate supply of green coffee beans is one of the 
>> checklist items as part of our home preparedness plan.  We have a 
>> plastic tub in our pantry with enough to get through a couple of 
>> months, if need be.  And to tide us over between annual crops.  At 
>> first we worried that beans would go stale, affecting flavor.  We 
>> intentionally waited to roast beans purchased a year ago, and they are
> still giving great results.
>> Best,
>> Howard
>>> On Sat, Nov 1, 2014 at 7:38 AM, Hank Arnold <hankarnold at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> There's no doubt Sweet Maria's is the Crown Jewel for service and 
>>> Beans....the only time I stray is when I don't order in time and need 
>>> the Beans by the weekend when i have time to roast, so I go to an 
>>> East Coast vendor that has good product and can be delivered at a 
>>> reasonable cost in 2 days, instead of it being a minimum of 5 from 
>>> Oakland.
>>> Hank
>>>> I've been an SM customer for about 20 years, starting back when they 
>>>> were based in Ohio. I got an e-mail from another company selling 
>>>> green coffee, so I put in a small order (4 1lb. bags) just to see how it
> was.
>>>> 2 of them were absolute dreck.  I had to cull so many beans out of 
>>>> one roast, it wasn't worth my time.  So 2 of them went right in the
> trash.
>>>> The other 2 are OK, but not even close to the quality that SM 
>>>> offers.  I will probably wind up tossing them, too.
>>>> I just want to thank Tom and his crew for taking the time to offer 
>>>> the best greens available.  They truly are a cut above.  Never again 
>>>> will I stray from the pack.
>>>> Randy
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