[Homeroast] City? City +? Full City?

Yakster yakster at gmail.com
Fri Feb 19 17:24:20 CST 2010

I use the Sweet Maria's Degrees of Roast chart as a guide and navigate
mostly by the cracks ending my roasts between city to full city+ (with one
or two Vienna or French exceptions).  I made some notes on the chart and
saved it as my background... this is what it looks like.


City -- First Crack Ends
City +
Full City
Full City + -- Second Crack Starts
French -- Second crack near end

The temperatures that you measure are going to differ by roaster and even
the bean colors will differ by method (drum, air, radiant, etc.) so it can
be hard to cross-compare.  Today I saw the Sivetz chart that describes the
degree of roast related to the % change in weight which will probably only
further confuse the issue:
http://www.sivetzcoffee.com/images/roastdegree1.jpg, but I'm sticking with
the Sweet Maria's definitions mainly because I saw them first and there's
more background information in the Sweet Maria's library to make a
consistent chart out of.


On Fri, Feb 19, 2010 at 3:02 PM, John A C Despres <johndespres at gmail.com>wrote:

> Here are some questions that I'm wondering about.
> What do you label your degree of roast? How do you know? When do they
> occur?
> There are several different lists of when a certain degree of roast is
> reached and they don’t match.
> Sweet Maria’s list is as follows also with pictures as reference:
> City + roast at 435°F, about 25 seconds after end of 1st crack
> Full City roast at 444°F about 25 seconds after 1st ends
> Full City + at 454°F about 1:50 after 1st ends
> http://www.sweetmarias.com/roasting-VisualGuideV2.php
> The HRO List has these divisions without temperatures but pictures as
> reference.
> Cinnamon roast just after 1st crack
> New England Roast
> American Roast
> City Roast
> Full City Roast just after 2nd crack
> http://www.homeroasters.org/index.htm
> Kenneth Davids has this list in his book Home Coffee Roasting
> Cinnamon roast below 400°F
> New England at 400°F
> American at 400-415°F
> City at 415-435°F
> Full City at435-445°F
> And also from Sweet Maria’s, this list at the bottom of the page
> George Steinert's Degree of Roast/Temperature chart:
> Early yellow at 327°F
> 1st Crack Begins at 401°F
> 1st Crack Under Way at 415°F
> City Roast at 426°F
> City+ at 435 °F
> Full City    446    °F
> Full City+    454    °F
> Vienna (Light French)    465    °F
> http://www.sweetmarias.com/roasting-VisualGuideV2.php
> Here’s yet another site with variances: (This one is interesting with lots
> of nice, seemingly accurate descriptions)
> http://www.cofei.com/categories/degree-of-roast-temperature-description.html
> My concern is communication amongst us home coffee roasters. My Full City +
> may be your Full City. Yet your Full City may come after 2nd crack and my
> Full City is before 2nd is remotely near.
> Which labeling system do you use? Is there yet another guide you go by? How
> can we better communicate our roast degree to one another?
> Some of us are able to determine bean temperature while others know the
> drum
> temperature only. Stating the temperature of when your roast ended is of
> great importance to some while it means nothing to me as there’s no way for
> me to know.
> All of this occurred to me this afternoon while chatting with the owner of
> a
> USRC. He knows as much as possible about his roasts, while I know exhaust
> temperature and time. Of course, these are both usable factors; I can base
> roasts on the information and then measure the bean temperature with an IR
> thermometer immediately upon pulling the drum. That could be great post
> roast information like recording the weight loss; there’s no way I can know
> it before the roast ends in my Gene Café.
> So, what do we call our roasts? How and why?
> John
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